Interview Gabriel Genc with Sabri Atman on the quarrel in Belgium

Aramean people: Aramean people (not to be confused with ‘Armenians’) speak Aramaic, the language spoken by Abraham, Moses and Jesus. They are the indigenous people of what was called in ancient times Aram- Nahrin, in our days it is called ‘Mesopotamia’.

Some Arameans today identify themselves with “Assyrians”, because of the spiritual colonial hate generating activities of the Western missionaries and diplomats in the Middle-East in 16th and 19th centuries. Other Arameans became known as “Chaldeans”. However all of them are Arameans.In Turkey, the Arameans are called: Süryani. In Arabic they are called Al- Suryan.

Interview Gabriel Genc with Sabri Atman on the quarrel in Belgium(http://www.ahna.nl/ )

Part 1 of the interview: 9-3- 2007

Please click here to download or to listen to the Mp3-audio file.

http://www.aramnahrin.org/Photo/Sabri_Atman_HazaelSomi_9_3_2007.mp3

Interviewer (Gabriel Genc van Ahna media): Peace be with teacher Sabri Atman.

Sabrie Atam: Peace

Interviewer: We heard the news from Belgium about the quarrel there..... with bishop Hazael Somi, the bishop of Belgium and France... what was the reason that you went to Belgium?

Sabri Atman: .. the last years I visit various places.... I have different programs, meetings (speeches) and else..... and last time I was invited in Belgium to give there two speeches. One of the meetings I was invited by bishop Hazael Somi. That was the reason I went to Belgium...... I went to give speeches and during the meeting the quarrel started with hazael Somi, something which was not my intention... apparently it was his!

Before explaining what has happened, I want to explain...... The last time we have organized various activities in several places ... in Swedish Parliament .... Parliament of Great Britain.... and now, 26th of this month (February), we have a meeting ... where also the vice - chairman of the European Parliament will give a speech on Genocide.... it is a bog meeting... and this meetings... this activities.... are being kept up by Turkey and discussed..... Turkey denounces our activities.... via diverse ways they try to stop us...until now they did not succeed to stop us. As far as I know.... the reason I was invited to Belgium... to Brussels seems that Hazael Somi and the Turkish Embassy are behind it. That is the conclusion I make.

He prepared (our coming) like this..... the news was differently announced in the churches in Brussels that at 16.00 h the meeting would take place. In other places it was anounced that the meeting would take place at 18.00 h.... however the meeting took place at 19:30 h.... with the goal to minimize the number of attendance to the meeting...

We went to the meeting at 19:30 h. Immediately upon arrival a Turk came to me and spoke in Turkish to me.... During my visits I come across different new people who speak to me... I do not have control over what is going on... A while later the bishop and I were sitting on the table... also the Chor- Episkopes... Chori Abdo arrived... who also was present at the meeting... and told bishop that there were strangers and that there were Turks in the saloon.... what is going on (he asked)? The bishop was shocked and stood up and told people 'I will speak to you in Syriac'... everybody should check the person sitting on the other side of the table... we should have control on the program, he said. Thereafter I was looking for the person who spoke to me, yet I could not find him anymore. The cameras of bishop Hazael... he had three cameras.... turned of of the cameras off and ordered the person to stop with the filming of the program and said 'It is forbidden to film here'. The other two cameras he told... I want to take the films with me.... in that way you can make film..... He checked everything in advance what should be filmed... and the goal seems to be that he will send the films to various peoples.

The bishop talked for a half hour... normally after that half hour he should have given me fife minutes- I was invited there- and in stead inviting me and saying please tell us what you want to tell... however he went on by telling a story. Thereafter I got the floor... I saw that the program had become too long for the audiences... and I hurried to talk about 35 minutes. The people became tired... but was very well satisfied with my message.

The time to ask the question had come. Before he gets a replay.... before he first have to listen... bishop Hazael Somi starts to deal with the questions. His behavior is so inferior... bishop unworthy... clergyman unworthy... asking questions himself and giving answers... question after question... he comments my speech... and tries to belittle his guest... with empty words... this bishop he considers himself very high-ranking.... thinks he is full of wisdom.... but he is empty. And the people understood all this things... and that is why it was very difficult for him... everything pointing with his finger to his head... and saying... 'I...I... I know it... I have studied... I have the achieves...' with that very arrogant behavior. I want to give a example 'he says that Sabri goes from country to country... gives speeches.. what do we have to do with Hrant Dink the Armenian? We were because of the Armenians....'

Hrant Dink?... evil forces... who two months ago in in broad daylight was killed and made his children oprhan and his wife widow... he wrote on the genocide... not only Syrians... Armenians... Turks.... many other peoples from diverse parts of the world were not happy and made it clear. And there comes bishop Hazael Somi to express his displeasure about why I commemorate Hrant Dink... was very uncomfortable... He did not listen and continued with story after story ... I became very angry of course sitting on my chair... waiting on him to give him a reply.. And he tells how many diploma's he has ... how much achieves he has ... how many files he has.

All these stories (of Hazael) are of course nonsense. Since I have met Hazael Somi, I know that he is a featherbrain. En the people of Belgium... it is now for the thirtieth time that I have been in Belgium, I did not saw more than three persons who were positive on the administration of Hazael Somi... everybody is talking about this issue...

With his story Hazael Somi denies the genocide... with his story he defends Turkey. However, each time he came in the corner, he told that he was not defending Turkey... I do not deny the genocide... however... the audiences were not blind.... If someone is not defending Turkey... if someone is not denying genocide, why than does he feel necessary every two minutes to remind the people that he is not denying the genocide and he is not defending the Turks?

All the attendances understood that bishop Hazael Somi denied genocide... the killing of the Syrian people.. Sceondly, all the attendances understood that what he was doing was defending Turkey..

That which he has said, I want shortly to summarize in few points:

Bishop Hazael Somi says, from the archives he claims remarkable enough to have at his disposal, that their generals accidentally ordered to take a table from there, they accidentally took all the tables, that is to say the killings, the goal, were Armenians, but they have accidentally also killed Syrians...

This is really.... outrageous... en clergyman of the Syrian Orthodox Church.... yet a bishop, who says something like this is a huge scandal. The Turks do not dare in this way to deny the genocide... they have not the courage to say that... it was accidentally.. Armenians... the slaughtering, we know that it was the slaughtering of the Christians in Turkey... that I have brought under attention... yet he did not want to listen....

On 14th of November, the year 1914 where Jihad call was made in Turkey, was not only aimed against the Armenians... but also against all the Christians, among them Syrians.

But our elderly people who watch this.... know that what is being commemorated meat.... meat is... they all were killed... the children of Zaz were killed... the belly of the women were ripped open with daggers... 80% of the family of this man... of this bishop were killed during the genocide....

There is something else which indicates that he denies the genocide... he says - he considers himself as a scholar, he has studied a lot, he has many files at his disposal, many achieves..., he says if a genocide was committed against the Syrian people, than no one of them would have survived...

..... a bishop who is ignorant... bishop Hazael... really.... makes a big mistake.. In Germany 6 million Jews

were killed... in order to categorize this as a genocide, no one Jew should have had survived? ... in Rwanda within three months 800.000 Tutsi's were killed... to say that this is a genocide... no one Tutsi should have had survived? .... a bishop like this one.. ignorant... in the Syrian Church... is really outrageous fo the Syrian Church and for our people...

… een bisschop die onkundig is..bisschop Hazael .. werkelijk.. maakt een grote fout.. In Duitsland werden 6 miljoen Joden vermoord… om te mogen zeggen dat het om genocide gaat, zou het dan geen Jood mogen zijn overgebleven?… in Rwanda werden er binnen drie maanden 800.000 Tutsi’s vermoord… om te mogen zeggen dat het om volkerenmoord gaat.. zou het dan geen enkel Tutsi mogen zijn overgebleven?... een bsischop als deze.. onkundig .. in de Syrische kerk.. is werkelijk schandelijk voor de Syrische Kerk en schandelijk voor ons volk..

Part 2 of the interview: 11-3- 2007.

Listen to the interview: http://www.aramnahrin.org/Photo/SabriAtman_HazaelSomi_11_3-2007.mp3

Sabri Atman:

What I also want to make clear to the listeners is that there are clergymen within our people who have ties with the Turkish secret service.. there are clergymen, bishops within our people, within the Syrian Church who work together with the Syrian secret service. We should be aware of all these matters. We should not give this people, now in the year 2007, permission anymore to misuse the division within our people against us... to exploit the conflict which exist on the names Assyrians, Arameans, Syrians, Chaldeans and to create more division for their personnel interests to rule us. This should be clear... we are Assyrians... we are Arameans... we are Syrians.. we are Chaldeans... all this names belong to us....

When a priest, a bishop come up and again notices this division and want to misuse it, we should prevent him in doing so. The Arameans is ours and of nobody else.... how dare he to come up with that to misuse it against the Aramean friends? We may give the hand to each other and work for our people.... and also on the issue of the genocide... Our people is not blind anymore as before so that they can come and scare them in this way and to rule them.

But that what I see... what we see.. they come to scare our people with the hell ... and they say look how terrible is the hell... and come to sell (Gods) kingdom.

Now in the year 2007, bishop Hazael should know that we will prevent him to scare our people by threatening with the hell and selling the kingdom. Bishop Hazael should know that our nation is not without persons who take care for them.... our people has persons who take care for the.

Over 8 years, it will the 100th anniversary of the genocide that took place. We have three goals ahead... but the first goal for us is the 100th year, the goal is this: those who 92 years ago were sitting to relax and did not do anything to the cry of distress of our people, we shall encourage them to listen to the cry. Our second goal is this: those who 92 years ago shut their mouth, we will open their mouth, those who closed their eyes, we shall open their eyes.... those who put cotton in their ears, we will remove the cotton from their ears so that they hear the cry of our people.

In the 100th anniversary we shall mobilize our people... if bishop Hazael and others... if they work together with Turkey.... if they prepare pitfalls for persons like me, we will not participate in the dame. Turkey, bishop Hazael and others cannot prevent our activities.... I pointed to the photo of Jesus and said "I swear on this photo that the bishop who is now in front of you, dear audiences, definitely has not 45 files and even not 45 pages... he has not fife pages... He said 'do you say to a bishop that he is lying?'...... Okay.... if I lie, tell me what you have read in these files... secondly who do you keep them secret?..... you had these files.... these achieves.... where do you bring them to?

Who has heard that bishop Hazael Somi has mobilized the people?....... Who has heard that Hazael Somi has discussed the issue and brought under the attention of the European Parliament, Swedish Parliament, Belgium Parliament and other countries. ... to whom is it known that bishop Hazael Somi has a archive... and has mobilized our youth and has worked for these matters... as a person... whose grandparents were killed during the genocide, to fulfill his duty..... nothing of these issues he has done... bishop Hazael Somi.....

Interviewer: This bishop.. what kind of relation does he has with the Turkish consulate?

Sabri Atman: Thank you very much for the question.... I had already discussed this point.. this bishop... the first contact with him I had was one year ago... it was by the phone... what he said was 'Sabri I hear about your and your friends... I have a different view.... He said... I have been educated... and talked about his files... that he was a great bishop and knows everything... He said I have files in my hands... the Kurds and the Turks have nothing to do with it.... Turkey has no mistakes... the English and France were responsible.... I have become a bishop in the Syrian Orthodox Church ... genocide... politics will not be tolerated in my church... en I... he said.... if I am not mistaken, the consulate has invited me bow for the third time... I had a conversation with the consulate of Turkey.... in honouring me, last time they offered a dinner" He is very proud to tell such stories.

However what should be clarified here is .... the consulate of Turkey.... what does it has to do with Hazael Somi whether you have honor or not... what does the consulate of Turkye has to do with your honor? Did he invite you because of his respect for you? You are a man of faith... the bishop of the Syrian Church.... a consul who is playing with you... who do you not wake up? ...

Our priests, our bishops should know these things. They should change this mentality... it is the mentality of Taliban. Bishop Hazael Somi has made a calendar with his photo and the photo of the consul on it.... with pride he shows it.... He says in honoring me they gave a dinner....

What has the consulate to do with the honor of the bishop of the Syrian Orthodox Church? What the Turks are doing is... that they have win the trust of some of our bishops whom they use against us.... And during my speech I told this to the audiences.... it was this where the audiences not were pleased with and stood up and walked away.... I said that I get information that Turkey says that they have won the trust our bishop and use them against us.... bishop Hazael Somi is one of them.... and he does not deny this.... says, I have enjoyed the meal with the Turks..... and something else... I do not deny the genocide... I do not defend the Turkey...

All his statements were to defend Turkey... really... The last thing I want to say .... bishop Hazael Somi is not the only one... there are also other clergymen involved.... With their clothes, with their beards.... with their mentality they have in their mind.... there is no difference between them and Taliban. They scare the people with the hell and sell the kingdom... they frighten our people... In the year 2007, we live in the year 2007.... The people is suffering.... the people should allow such issues.....It is necessary that those priests, those clergymen, those bishops who damage the people.... they should know that there are people like me who already for a long time work together with the hell... we will not allow them to sell the kingdom to our people.... They should understand themselves.....

Bishop Hazael Somi, if he cannot rule his episcopacy ..... it is time that he give up his function and become a official with the Turkish government.... perhaps they can offer him a function within the Turkish consulate......

I... have.... may the Lord bless his soul.... together wish bishop Cicek.... visited various churches, gave various speeches.... together with bishop Benjamin in Sweden... together with the clergymen of the Syrian Church..... few churches where I not have been.... and all of them paid respect to me... they saw and were shocked.... and were very happy....

Some of the churches where I have been they asked for the 2e and 3e time whether I would came back. This is the first time... tha I come across such a bishop.... arrogant bishop... who considers himself very high.... but is empty... bishop who works together with Turkey.... who proudly shows his photo together with the Turkish consulate... This is a shame... I.... if this bishop will not give up his function.... than my name is not Sabri Atman... that I can say.

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